Former Vice President Mike Pence’s autobiography So Help Me God, set to be published next week, will detail a number of never-heard-before conversations between former President Donald Trump and his ex-running mate. 

Some excerpts of those conversations were published by Wall Street Journal, on Wednesday, which gave readers a behind-the-scenes look into what went down between Trump and Pence in the days leading up to the infamous Capitol riots on January 6, 2021, when hundreds of Trump supporters stormed the congressional building, some chanting that Pence should be hanged. 

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‘You’re too honest’

Five days before Trump told his supporters to “fight like hell” which eventually led them to storm the US Capitol, Pence said that he and Trump discussed a lawsuit filed by Republicans which was about asking a judge to declare that the-then vice-president had “‘exclusive authority and sole discretion to decide which electoral votes should count”.

In his book, the former VP writes that Trump told him that if the suit “gives you the power, why would you oppose it?” At that, Pence “told him, as I had many times, that I didn’t believe I possessed that power under the constitution”.

“You’re too honest. Hundreds of thousands are gonna hate your guts… People are gonna think you’re stupid,” Trump added, according to Pence. 

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‘You’ll go down as a wimp’ 

Pence also recounted his version of a call with Trump on the morning of January 6. During the call, Trump called his vice-president a “p*ssy.”

The former VP wrote: “The president laid into me. ‘You’ll go down as a wimp,’ he said. ‘If you [don’t block certification], I made a big mistake five years ago!’”

‘Were you scared?’

Pence also goes into what happened in the aftermath of the riots. Although the media and the outer world assumed that Trump and Pence were not on talking terms with each other, that was not the case. 

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In one such meeting held on January 11, with the-then leader of the free world, Pence said Trump “looked tired, and his voice seemed fainter than usual”. Over the phone, Pence informed him that his wife and daughter were also at the Capitol during the deadly attack, Trump “responded with a hint of regret.” At that time Trump was on the heels of facing his second impeachment. 

Trump apparently asked Pence about the attack, “Were you scared?”

Pence wrote, “‘No,’ I replied, ‘I was angry. You and I had our differences that day, Mr. President, and seeing those people tearing up the Capitol infuriated me.’ He started to bring up the election, saying that people were angry, but his voice trailed off. I told him he had to set that aside, and he responded quietly, ‘Yeah.’”

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‘It’s been fun’

There is also an interaction recalled by Pence from January 14, the day after Trump was impeached for the second time.

“I reminded him that I was praying for him,” Pence wrote. Trump answered, “Don’t bother. It’s been fun.” When Pence told the former president that he would “never stop praying” for him, the latter smiled and replied, “That’s right – don’t ever change.”